Toddy Wozniak Interview 

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Thomas "Toddy" Wozniak as a young man in the CCC's. He was born in Branfort, Conn. In 1915. He was the 8th child in a family of 16 children. (Donna Wozniak photo)

W: Well, there wasn't much to do. It was 1937 when I came out here. I was working for General Motors; I didn't like the job so I quit and came out here. The environment and everything was bad back there; things were slow, and there was no work. I came from Harrison, New Jersey. It's just a few miles out of New York City, across the river.

G: Could you tell me what a typical day was like in the CCC' 

CCC boys clearing brush out of the irrigation ditches. (Donna Wozniak photo)

W: We'd get up about six in the morning and have revelry at seven. At seven-thirty we'd eat, and at eight o'clock we were ready to go to work. They'd take you out in trucks. They had four or five crews, about thirty guys to a truck. We'd go out on different projects like building corrals, roads, reservoirs, and fences; and reseeding, killing prairie dogs and things like that. You know that trough down in front of Ben Black's house? They made that. He found it up on the mountain where they left it. We'd cut the trees down and make them.

There were about 180 to 200 kids in camp. They (the government) would pay your way out here. Then you stayed six months, and they'd pay your way home. They paid you $30 a month; twenty-five of it went home and you kept five. You also got your food, clothing and medical treatment. If you were an assistant leader, you got $36 a month; $25 went home and you kept the rest. If you got to be a leader, you made $45 a month; you kept $20 and $25 was sent home. They'd eat at noon, and about three-thirty they'd start back home and get in camp about four o'clock. Then the day was theirs.

G: Some of the boys learned their trade in the CCC's. Did you?

Toddy Wozniak on the right with "one arm" Ramsey and friend,  in front of Hatch's trading post in 1938. Taken while working on the Needle Nose project. (Donna Wozniak photo)

W: No, I worked up on the mountain, and all we did there was cut trees down. We also built a reservoir out near Hovenweep, and built corrals. That top road that goes into Montezuma Creek? We built the first one. We also built the road just down under where Hatch's trading post is. That corral that's there was built by the CCC's, the one going to Bluff.

G: I've interviewed people who all say they can remember fighting between the town and the CCC boys, but they can't remember any particular examples.
 
W: Well, one Sunday night we were going downtown . . . You didn't know Mike Camberlango, did you? Somebody said that two tall guys were going to hogtie him. That night, 75 (CCC) guys marched downtown looking for the two guys that were going to hogtie him! They couldn't find them.

G: I guess you guys took pretty good care of each other.

W: Yes. If they had any trouble among themselves, they had six or seven pairs of boxing gloves in camp. They'd form a circle around them in camp, throw them in it, and tell them to go ahead and get it over with! They'd get over it! It taught them how to live with each other, and how to get along.
 

CCC boys bulding a ditch in Blanding.  (Donna Wozniak photo)

 
G: What were some of the responsibilities that the leaders and the assistant leaders had?

W: They took care of the crew. They issued the tools; they decided what tool to give to what person, who would use it the best and get the most work out of it. They also watched the men work, and saw that they did their jobs and got along.

G: I've heard the story about the CC boys blowing up the safe at Lyman's garage. Do you remember that story or any others relating to it?

W: Parley Redd's was robbed! A lot of times things were robbed from town, the robbers would come and throw the keys in the CCC gate. Now if they (the CCC boys) were going to rob, they wouldn't throw the keys there! They did find a gun under one of the barracks, a 30-30, that must have belonged to Parley Redd, but they could never prove anything.

G: Could you tell me any of the pranks that happened in camp, maybe initiations or anything like that?

W: When a guy came, they'd want to break him in! They'd strip him down and throw him in a cold shower. They had these G.I. brushes, and they'd rub him down with one of them till he was red as a beet. Also, they had a kid that was pretty slow. They dressed him up one night, put a raincoat on him and boots and a hat, and gave him a lantern and a pail filled with papers. Then they put him up on top of the roof and told him he had to flag down the mail plane! They sent another one downtown for a bucket of steam. Then, two of them wanted to know where all of the beer joints were and somebody sent them to Bluff. They walked clear to Bluff and back; there was nothing down there. 

George and Lona Hurst.  He was a member of the school board in the1930's. (SJHC collection)

W: No. The only thing I know was one guy, Kelly Black, you wouldn't know him, had a fifth of whiskey--this was a town guy, not a CC-- up at the Junior High. He had it inside his coat pocket with a straw in it. He'd dance around and take a big slug of it, and then dance around again, with his hand on the bottle. George Hurst was on the school board, and he was sitting there eyeing him like an eagle. He jumped up and grabbed him and said, "Look what I took from Kelly Black!" And he held up the whiskey.

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